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Messages - Nao
5206
Features / Re : Rewriting the skin file parser...
« on May 15th, 2012, 05:41 PM »
Yup, I did mean using the 'regular' cache, and that the admin button for clearing the cache could possibly clear it all (the .php files, at the very least.)
5207
Other software / Re: Has SMF Gotten Slower?
« on May 15th, 2012, 05:37 PM »
There are plenty of conversations worth having... And even more features to implement :P
5208
Features / Re : Rewriting the skin file parser...
« on May 15th, 2012, 04:20 PM »
Can you reformulate?
5209
Other software / Re: Has SMF Gotten Slower?
« on May 15th, 2012, 04:20 PM »
Which is when you start to forget what avatar you wanted for a post, and you delete it, and then the post has to rely on the default avatar, etc... Sometimes, flexibility isn't exactly for the best.
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Features / Re : Rewriting the skin file parser...
« on May 15th, 2012, 03:54 PM »
It's not cached by stat...
http://www.php.net/manual/en/function.clearstatcache.php
There's a list of functions affected -- glob is not among them.

What we could do is add a link to the Admin menu where we would delete the cache. And then we could store the current (complete) skin file list in a regular Wedge cache file, with a relatively short latency (a couple of minutes?). What do you think...?
Posted: May 15th, 2012, 03:50 PM

As for the main menu, the system may be a bit too complex to be usable in a "simple" mini-menu.
It's done pretty much this way: store parent items into a special span (not a big fan but...), and apply on hover a .hove class. And then create my menu inside the span (or div), this way the parent item still has the 'hove' class even though it's no longer actually hovered.

What I liked about the mini-menu thing is that by being a direct child of the anchor, it would automatically adapt to its position, as well as keep the :hover state on the parent link. But I'm not ready either to have some browsers apply :hover to every single child item, even when not hovered... Meh!
I'll look into the span, then...
5211
Other software / Re: Has SMF Gotten Slower?
« on May 15th, 2012, 03:45 PM »
I know LJ does it, and I know it scared the hell out of me when I finally understood what was going on...
And I certainly don't like that too much.

What I'd like, with multiple avatars, would be the ability to set one avatar per board.
For instance, on noisen.com if I'm posting on my anime-related board, I'd like for my avatar to be a Saint Seiya picture. If I'm posting on the AeMe board, I'd like for it to be a more generic avatar... Etc.
5212
Other software / Re: Has SMF Gotten Slower?
« on May 15th, 2012, 11:40 AM »
Quote from Arantor on May 15th, 2012, 03:39 AM
It's not done by default, and I didn't make the conversion by default (and strip out the rest of the code) because we were looking at putting it all through Aeva for potentially-multiple-avatars-per-member.
Another nail into my coffin, eh... :P
I'm a rock. I'm solid. I won't bow to your petty remarks eheh. It'll be for Wedge 2.0 at the earliest. I don't want to get going on another long period of trial and error, implementing something that we don't even know is going to work better...

(Or maybe I'll just do it in a couple of days when I'm bored at some point. You never know with me...)
5213
Features / Re: Action buttons: positioning
« on May 15th, 2012, 10:20 AM »
@godboko> I developped the code in Opera 11, where there are no underlines.
Indeed, Chrome (if that's what you're using) seems to be showing underlines. This is probably because it applies the :hover element to all its children, so when you hover the user name, it gets underlined (as dictated by my CSS), and creates a mini-menu which is set as a child of it, now I have to determine which browser is doing things 'correctly', and how to fix it. And yes, I don't like having underlining either, at least not on a theme where underlining is shown only on hover. So, basically, I'll try to remember how I did it in the main menus, where the hover effect is a background color, and it seems to apply correctly everywhere (i.e. hover on the parent item, AND only on the currently hovered child.)

Of course, the alternative would be to do it like I used to do before the big commit: attach the mini menus to the body element instead, so they never inherit their parent's style. It also forces me to set their position absolutely, although it also fixes some other issues... But it just doesn't feel 'right', and I'd rather not resort to this hack again.

@John> Yep, I know :) And one of my goals is to harmonize these looks... But I love them both. I may even, I don't know, try to look into using my minimenu styling on main menus, although I probably won't keep that... Main menus need to be stylish and very neutral, because they're used a lot. Mini menus can be more daring, I'd say. Right now I love both, so it's going to be interesting trying to do something out of these.

@Pete> I guess I'm going to have to benchmark both the current solution (i.e. doing file_exists on all possible filenames and suffixes) and the glob solution (i.e. doing a single glob() call and getting all files from the generated list.) Come to think of it, I do so many file_exists permutations (because of the growing number of suffixes and the fact that even the default stylesheet already has at least 3 potential files or more, index, sections, custom...), if it wasn't cached already it would be quite slow to do on every page... Actually it's best that PHP doesn't cache it and the OS does it -- at least it can be cached over several sessions and page loads ;)
5214
Other software / Re: Has SMF Gotten Slower?
« on May 14th, 2012, 12:36 PM »
Quote from Arantor on May 14th, 2012, 12:05 PM
The DB layer won't help, certainly. But I consider the trade-off in performance for that component on its own quite acceptable for the actual increase in security it brings (considering third party modifications etc.)
I'm sure everyone will agree :)
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The other major performance headache is post moderation. There's no way around it, it is a performance headache if it is turned on.
And this is what still makes me unsure how to implement post privacy, i.e. what is basically stalling Wedge the most and caused me to post a call for help in the shape of a haiku... :lol: (Because I'm preeeeetty sure that once we get this done, Wedge is 99% ready for a public alpha...)
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For all other situations, you'd need to compare them with as-close-to-identical setup, so any optimisation work you did for 1.x (e.g. turn off calendar, DB tables being InnoDB and appropriate table structure changes to convert from tinytext to varchar) would need to be mirrored in 2.x.
I'm still sure it's mostly about perceived performance. It's best to test with PageSpeed or YSlow, and of course also enable benchmarking in SMF and check the query logs to see if generation times on the server are pretty much the same or not. If they're similar, then it's a problem with client-side caching, multiple JS/CSS files and so on. (i.e. my domain of choice 8))
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Also if you haven't already, switch the avatars to their own folder.
Here's wondering if we're already doing it by default in Wedge... If not, we probably should :P
Posted: May 14th, 2012, 12:23 PM
Quote from Nao on May 14th, 2012, 12:23 PM
And this is what still makes me unsure how to implement post privacy, i.e. what is basically stalling Wedge the most and caused me to post a call for help in the shape of a haiku... :lol: (Because I'm preeeeetty sure that once we get this done, Wedge is 99% ready for a public alpha...)
Forgot about custom groups... That one is annoying, too: I still don't know if it's realistic to keep having a list of membergroups in the member table, or if we should always join another table.

(Crap... If only I had the balls to say "let's postpone this to a later version" and actually STICK to it and make a converter later...)
5215
Features / Re: New revs
« on May 14th, 2012, 10:06 AM »
rev 1582
(17 files, 6kb)

* Renamed ul.quickbuttons to ul.actions -- shorter, and semantically it makes more sense as these were only used for action buttons anyway. Also harmonized all of the action buttons I could find, by adding an action bar where needed, and moving everything below the post bodies. Renamed quickbuttons.png to actions.png. The stuff in post.js is untested. (Display.template.php, PersonalMessage.template.php, Post.template.php, Search.template.php, post.js, index.ie6.css, index.ie7.css, index.member.css, index.rtl.css, Wireless/sections.css)

* #version_details didn't really need to be limited in height at this point... (admin.css)

- Removed a line-break from the admin login page, because there was already a hardcoded margin above the button... (Login.template.php)

! Fixed mini-menu CSS on Mobile Safari: forgot the z-index and ensured that user menus actually show up (although this one's a very odd bug and even weirder hack which I'm likely to reconsider later.) (sections.css, Warm/index.css, Wireless/sections.iphone.css)

@ Note: forgot to commit the actions.png rename... Please do it manually if you're updating to this rev, it'll be fixed in my next commit...
5216
Other software / Re: Has SMF Gotten Slower?
« on May 14th, 2012, 09:07 AM »
Perceived performance may be slower because of the increased size of JavaScript and CSS files, btw.
That's why I worked hard on fixing this for Wedge...
5217
Other software / Re: Has SMF Gotten Slower?
« on May 14th, 2012, 08:26 AM »
I *don't* think it's any (noticeably) slower...
It's usually the kind of situation where to compare, you must install two stock versions side to side and fill them with random data...
5218
Features / Rewriting the skin file parser...
« on May 14th, 2012, 07:47 AM »
Re: suffixes, I forgot to say...
I want to do a rewrite because the current implementation is a bit flawed (in at least an edge case.)
My main goal with the rewrite would be to allow for comma-separated lists of suffixes in any file.
index.ie6,ie7,ie9,member1.css would thus target member #1 if he uses ie except ie8.
To achieve this, I suspect that doing a glob() call would be enough. Then for each file -- explode the suffixes, and check whether they're in our list.

Only thing I'm not sure about -- performance. Is glob() optimized enough, does the folder list stay in memory as much as possible..? I suspect so, but I don't know for now.
5219
Features / Re: Action buttons: positioning
« on May 14th, 2012, 01:18 AM »
Quote from Arantor on May 13th, 2012, 10:42 PM
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You mean, the notice number? I don't know...
I like it, works pretty well.
I'm thinking about moving the number to *after* the 'Like' text, though...
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I did, yes, though I didn't get as far as actually writing the JS for it.
Shouldn't be too hard... If anything I can help :)
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Yes, dates are stored, in the likes table. The only think about using minimenus there is that you'd be getting a menu with a single item, since I think I'd rather the main like button but a one click without menu interaction.
Oh there'd be more than one item...
- Who liked (if there's no like, show "Be the first to like this", the usual one...), with a link to the popup
- a separator
- a Like button, or Unlike button, depending on the status
- maybe things like "Last liked on May 12th..."

Anyway, it doesn't have to be a *menu*, it could very simply be a mega-menu type item, i.e. a regular div with some styling in it.
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Oh, I don't mind :) I was wanted to be sure I wasn't seeing things. Don't worry about member ids in the suffixes, I think that's complexity that isn't really needed in this case. (And I like the design experiments, it's nice to see someone experimenting with something cool)
My experiments are often failed ones... Anything I commit is usually the results of quite some time of use on my side, resulting in a situation where I felt comfortable going for a commit ;)

BTW, I have yet to find the problem with the absolute positioning and stuff.
But it 'barely' works by simply removing the position:relative from .umme (.acme works fine with it and doesn't work without it), so I did that... I HATE doing a hack that I don't understand in the first place, but I have only so much time I can devote to a single problem at a time.
Please test on other browsers whether action & user menus work...

:edit: Wireless + Opera 11 = user menu still works, but isn't proper under the user name. Meh...
5220
Features / Re: Action buttons: positioning
« on May 13th, 2012, 10:37 PM »
Quote from Arantor on May 13th, 2012, 10:23 PM
I like the look, and the experience attached to the animation but it's gone over my head as far as figuring out how to fix it. I've always taken the view that I make it work, but don't necessarily make it pretty.
Yeah...
Well, right now the action menu doesn't really work, it's not even the same version as in my local test but it's worse there actually... So I'll leave it as is right now, don't worry I'll fix it.
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Going back to the overall topic, I really like how the Like button works now, took a little while to get used to it.
You mean, the notice number? I don't know...
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Making that work via AJAX shouldn't be too problematic (I don't think you did that already?)
I think you added support for that. There's definitely a placeholder for it in the template.
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but I do find it a bit complicated as to how we would display a list of the people who like something,
Would have to be on a click. I'm envisioning my mini-menus as popups that can be put anywhere (and I'll definitely do it this way), so I'll add a mini-menu to the Like button as I said, with the names of the first likers etc, and then a link to view more, which'll open a popup or something with all names. (And dates? Do you store dates?)
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not that I could ever figure out how the list should look when we do get it (as I'm not entirely sure we should use the popups as they stand, but I'm not entirely we shouldn't either)
You'll see, it'll work well.
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Also, have you changed the font lately? Either that or my browser is rendering text weirdly.
Yeah, sorry, forgot to ask you if you didn't mind... The header font is Helvetica Narrow (which I'm downloading off somewhere, and it's totally a non-free font so it'll never be in Wedge or even on Wedge.org for guests or members), and the text font is Calibri. Since you're using Win7 like me, you should have the nice Calibri as well, and Helvetica is downloaded so it's okay.
Thing is, this setup is ONLY for admins (and you're one, now!), I'm thinking maybe I should add support for things like member IDs in the css suffixes, so that you don't have to cope with my design tests...