Arantor

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Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #15, on May 6th, 2011, 11:21 AM »
Let's be honest for a minute.

Of the current dev team, one of them has outright said he is "just the markup guy". One of them is a capable modder/coder, the other is relatively unknown. Between them, that doesn't really spell 'vision' to me.

EDIT: Getting rid of GIFs can be advantageous but doing so just because you want rid of GIFs isn't particularly clever. Unless he means fresher images too...
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Artur

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Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #16, on May 6th, 2011, 11:10 PM »
Quote from Nao/Gilles on May 6th, 2011, 11:18 AM
Oh, just for fun...
http://dev.simplemachines.org/mantis/view.php?id=4714
Seriously Ante, you're STILL at that point for SMF 2.1? That's what makes you vomit in SMF2? GIFs? How about animated GIFs? How about small GIFs that are smaller than their PNG counterpoint? (Yes, there are.) How about you get to work on the real stuff that makes any designer vomit when looking at the SMF files? (There are plenty to choose from. GIF overuse is certainly not at the top of the list...)
I would say it depends. I see that my normal gifs (not animated) are sometimes bigger than the png counterparts. I lol'd about that bug report. But honestly, does that even count as a bug? :hmm:

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Road Rash Jr.

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Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #18, on May 7th, 2011, 03:09 AM »
According to one support specialist  :whistle: post today, RC5 is near ready for release
http://www.simplemachines.org/…c=402014.msg3036936#msg3036936
It amazes me that with so few people on the team one hand has no clue what the other is doing. And I see they just took on a new support specialist who in my opinion made the grade by her post count hedged by "We are all volunteers here", "Stop asking questions".
More post like that will surely be rewarded with a promotion to developer.
Seems she fits right in the the other obnoxious team members.
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Nao

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Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #19, on May 7th, 2011, 07:54 AM »
Who are you talking about?

(oh and the post you linked is by LexArma. He's here, too!)
Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #20, on May 7th, 2011, 08:42 AM »
Quote from Artur on May 6th, 2011, 11:10 PM
I would say it depends. I see that my normal gifs (not animated) are sometimes bigger than the png counterparts. I lol'd about that bug report. But honestly, does that even count as a bug? :hmm:
No, but to some short-sighted people it would, so I'm not surprised.

GIFs are usually bigger than the PNG equivalent (especially PNG-8). But not that much. Usually, big GIFs are caused by unoptimized palette handling. Just look at how SmushIt can reduce a GIF size by half sometimes. Also, the original reason for going PNG instead of GIF was because of the patent around GIF. Well, it no longer is an issue, since the patent has expired AFAIK.

Arantor

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Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #21, on May 7th, 2011, 09:10 AM »
On the nature of the team: yes, RC5 is "practically final" so it was a fair comment to make.

Yes, that lovely person who basically mini-moderates everything is a decent % of the comment I made recently about not really being right for the team, because all she is doing is not answering questions. Now, during my time, I did some of that (we all did) but her bluntness makes my bluntness look tame.

On PNGs: there are three reasons to use PNG over GiF: file size is usually smaller, the LZW patent and true colour support.

On the matter of file size, you can often tweak and gouge to make it smaller; that's one of the perks of variable encodings of lossless compression. Sometimes GIF will win but usually it doesn't. True colour support including alpha makes for prettier images but IE6 not supporting it without a hack made it painful. And yes, the LZW patent has expired at least in the US and most if not all of the European countries where it was registered.

Nao

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Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #22, on May 7th, 2011, 10:04 AM »
Quote from Arantor on May 7th, 2011, 09:10 AM
Yes, that lovely person who basically mini-moderates everything is a decent % of the comment I made recently about not really being right for the team, because all she is doing is not answering questions. Now, during my time, I did some of that (we all did) but her bluntness makes my bluntness look tame.
I still don't know who that is...
Quote
True colour support including alpha makes for prettier images but IE6 not supporting it without a hack made it painful.
IE6 supports it through PNG8, although it's pretty much impossible to guarantee your icon will be very legible. I know that the AeMe icons, once converted to PNG8, don't look very good in IE6 because of a bad estimation on the alpha level threshold (I probably would prefer to have them with a gray background in that case.) Still, overall filesize is now half of what it is in AeMe for SMF. And since I'm all about saving bandwidth to make space for jQuery...

Arantor

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Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #23, on May 7th, 2011, 10:08 AM »
I'm referring to Illori.

As for IE6, if users will use that decade old pretender, they can expect it to look crap.

Nao

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Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #24, on May 7th, 2011, 10:30 AM »
Hmm... Never seen a post by her, so I can't say.

IE6: doesn't change to me... 11% market share means I have to provide minimum support for it. Bad graphics and bad layout happen everyday for IE6 users (on every other website), so I don't bother with that, but it's still the same as 8 months ago: I want to piss people off for keeping using that decade-old browser, but I always feel compelled to do some extra work to support them. The quest for perfection is a double-edged sword.

Arantor

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Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #25, on May 7th, 2011, 10:33 AM »
I'm not averse to it *working* on IE6 but I don't really want to burn time making it look good.

Nao

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Artur

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Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #27, on May 7th, 2011, 09:59 PM »
Quote from Nao/Gilles on May 7th, 2011, 10:30 AM
Hmm... Never seen a post by her, so I can't say.

IE6: doesn't change to me... 11% market share means I have to provide minimum support for it. Bad graphics and bad layout happen everyday for IE6 users (on every other website), so I don't bother with that, but it's still the same as 8 months ago: I want to piss people off for keeping using that decade-old browser, but I always feel compelled to do some extra work to support them. The quest for perfection is a double-edged sword.
But why? Even Microsoft want users to switch to a newer version of IE. http://ie6countdown.com/

Almost 40% of your 11% market share comes from china...

Nao

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Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #28, on May 8th, 2011, 12:04 AM »
Yeah, I know this site, it's the only thing that keeps me sane. Ask Pete, I keep repeating to myself that "we don't care about the Chinese market do we?" :P

The 34.6% market share for China is not inside IE.
What it means is that 34.6% of all Chinese Internet users are running IE6.
.346 x 500M (approx) = about 170 million people in China are using IE6.....
Since there are a bit over 2 billion Internet users worldwide, that would mean China's IE6 share accounts for ((500M/2B) * .346) = 8% or so of all Internet users are Chinese IE6 users. 8% out of 11% is about 75%...

So, basically, 75% of all IE6 users in the world are Chinese.

(Correct me if my calculations are wrong. I may not have the most recent data, and I didn't launch my calculator :P)

Road Rash Jr.

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Re: SMF 2.0 final THIS MONTH?
« Reply #29, on May 8th, 2011, 01:38 AM »
Just look at the bottom of the box, doesn't it say 'Made in China'? :thanks: :whistle: