Plugins NOT modifying core files

Arantor

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Plugins NOT modifying core files
« on January 12th, 2012, 02:26 AM »
I've been thinking about this lately after cruising around sm.org, and the more I think about it, the more I don't want files being edited by plugins.

If a plugin requires a core edit, the user should have to do that themselves. We lose the ability to do quick patches SMF style, but I'm not convinced that's a bad thing either.

What finally made me change my mind? The number of reports of 'my site's been hacked'. Sure, on shared hosting you're definitely at more risk than you are on a VPS, but there is an inherent risk on a shared host that is made distinctly worse by having to change the file permissions, especially as people will often go away and change them to be writable generally when they don't need to, to avoid hassle in the future.

By limiting the scope of what is needed to be edited, the core files never need to be handled in that way.

The only argument that is on the other side of the fence is about people doing raw changes, but firstly if you are doing raw changes, that puts the onus on you to back up and so on. And it puts the onus on you to remember the changes you made.

Thing is, WP acts like this and it seems to be tolerated over there, but what happens is that the automated update actually can tell you what files are changing and you can then go away and figure out for yourself whether you should or should not deal with that.

I have no problem telling users that if they're going to modify the core software, they're responsible for the consequences, but I'm not going to babysit them for upgrading. There are good reasons why hacking the core shouldn't be done, and I'm finally convinced beyond doubt now that the benefits are easily outweighed by the problems attached.
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Nao

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Re: Plugins NOT modifying core files
« Reply #1, on January 12th, 2012, 08:16 AM »
Well sure. Maybe they could edit non-core files though?

In any case, if you don't implement this ability, how about getting rid of the SFTP file? :eheh:

live627

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Arantor

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Re: Plugins NOT modifying core files
« Reply #3, on January 12th, 2012, 09:03 AM »
Quote from Nao on January 12th, 2012, 08:16 AM
Well sure. Maybe they could edit non-core files though?
I can think of cases where you might want to, yes. But it's pretty limited.
Quote
In any case, if you don't implement this ability, how about getting rid of the SFTP file? :eheh:
That should stay in either case: you still gotta get plugins on there in the first place, though it is still a ton easier to get them on there than it is in SMF's case...

MultiformeIngegno

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Arantor

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Re: Plugins NOT modifying core files
« Reply #5, on January 13th, 2012, 10:13 AM »
Any more opinions?

It doesn't change any code at all since there's no code implemented for this as yet.

Nao

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Re: Plugins NOT modifying core files
« Reply #6, on January 13th, 2012, 11:45 AM »
It can always be reallowed later.

Wedge is complicated enough as it is internally. Might as well make things easier for everyone ;)

Arantor

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Re: Plugins NOT modifying core files
« Reply #7, on January 13th, 2012, 12:39 PM »
It needs to be implemented first before it can be reallowed ;)

It would certainly keep things cleaner though it would force us to make sure everything can be touched from hooks of some description.

Nao

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Re: Plugins NOT modifying core files
« Reply #8, on January 13th, 2012, 01:46 PM »
And that's the thing with Wedge: we can add new hooks at will... People will know that they can safely overwrite their files with new versions of Wedge that add new hooks that allow them to install plugins that make use of these new hooks. (And that's a lot of that!)