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Messages - xrunner
91
Archived fixes / Re: Database Error while adding additional text to my Signature
« on May 23rd, 2013, 11:48 PM »
Yes sir it works now - I even read the little number at the bottom of the forum like I was supposed to before I tried it. :+1:
92
Off-topic / Re: Automagically De-Nesting Quotes
« on May 23rd, 2013, 11:45 PM »Breaking a quote up... press quote, place cursor where you want to
break the quote, press shift+Enter, it's just magic. ;)
That would really help the problem too. Nice!
93
Off-topic / Re: Automagically De-Nesting Quotes
« on May 23rd, 2013, 11:21 PM »Maybe we could offer the ability to strip quotes if they're more than 2 levels down, i.e. no more than a quote and a child quote are allowed... That way, we maintain context, and avoid pyramids entirely... Is that better, now..?
Anyway, what I offered still holds:
- adding a "show this quote" button for quotes below the first level,
- using e-mail-like quotes in the post area, so that you can easily delete the quotes, without having to look for quote tags, e.g.
> > Quote: Arantor
> > Nice...
>
> Quote: Nao
> Hello, world.
I know for a fact that new forum users (and some old ones that should know by now) don't seem to be able to figure out how to quote properly. I believe that is one reason they just click "quote" and proceed to add to whatever they get, because they don't have a clue how to break it up. I've even written tutorials on it. That's one more problem with nested quotes - it looks like a logic puzzle to a lot of people when viewed in the raw. Hell, I've even run across some that I wanted to break up that were confusing to work on, they had so much going on.
94
Off-topic / Re: Automagically De-Nesting Quotes
« on May 23rd, 2013, 08:45 PM »While I certainly won't knock anyone for having opinions that conflict, opinions that can be backed up with a justification/support argument are much more valuable. Knowing *why* someone holds the opinion they do can be important.
Person A
Person B
Person A
Person C
and so on.
Nesting what was never nested to begin with doesn't make any sense to me - in other words quoting multiple members should never have been nested at all. Does the forum itself nest each post as they come into a thread? No. It's put in sequence. Then why change that for a quote? Why change the appearance? I don't understand what it adds. Where did that ever come from anyway (I'd like to know just for grins).
Why make it look like a ballooning-out sort of thing when that's not at all what it is. Like I said, it's a sequence structure - not a ballooning-out structure. The way it works now isn't indicative of what's going on (IMHO). And, as I said, before, the larger the nesting gets the harder it is to see who's name goes with what text - that's a fact of the nesting. If you don't nest the quotes to begin with (in a quote) you both represent the original way it appears in the forum, and you see very neatly who's name goes with each quote.
:)
If you need any evidence of the mess it makes, go to this thread and scroll down - you don't have to read a single word, just look at the visuals of the nesting that people end up putting in the thread.
http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php/topic,24943.58.html
It's a mess and few people read the mess, they just look at the outside membername to see who they are trying to respond to. I've dealt with this for years and it frustrates the hell out of me. >:(
But we're all here to give ideas and improvements. I realize we can't all be right. :)
95
Off-topic / Re: Automagically De-Nesting Quotes
« on May 23rd, 2013, 08:15 PM »Not only that but de-nesting is less readable to me because it loses its scope which nesting provides.
96
Off-topic / Re: Automagically De-Nesting Quotes
« on May 23rd, 2013, 07:18 PM »
The problem with the quote button is that it selects all of the text in the post (including other nested quotes), which is usually more than is needed. You must think about what you don't need.
Here's another idea - may or may not be easy to implement. What if, when you clicked "quote" for a reply, you got an intermediate window or forced step. Now, with this, you must select what you want for your response. By default nothing is selected - this forces you to select what you need. Sure, a person could simply select all of it anyway, but I think it gives people a chance to really think about what they are selecting and why. It could even have a message -
"Please select ONLY the minimum required for your response"
In other words the way it is now is an opt-out paradigm - you remove what you don't need (and lots of people don't opt-out of anything). It's too easy to click quote and start typing your respons
The new way would be opt-in paradigm - you select what you do need and only then can you add your response
Now that would be super-neat IMHO.
Here's another idea - may or may not be easy to implement. What if, when you clicked "quote" for a reply, you got an intermediate window or forced step. Now, with this, you must select what you want for your response. By default nothing is selected - this forces you to select what you need. Sure, a person could simply select all of it anyway, but I think it gives people a chance to really think about what they are selecting and why. It could even have a message -
"Please select ONLY the minimum required for your response"
In other words the way it is now is an opt-out paradigm - you remove what you don't need (and lots of people don't opt-out of anything). It's too easy to click quote and start typing your respons
The new way would be opt-in paradigm - you select what you do need and only then can you add your response
Now that would be super-neat IMHO.
97
Archived fixes / Re: Database Error while adding additional text to my Signature
« on May 23rd, 2013, 12:07 AM »Um... this site is still using r2127 as per the footer...
98
Archived fixes / Re: Database Error while adding additional text to my Signature
« on May 22nd, 2013, 11:50 PM »This should be resolved in r2129, but I haven't been able to test it thoroughly.
99
Off-topic / Re: Automagically De-Nesting Quotes
« on May 22nd, 2013, 02:40 AM »I am glad our admin was smart enough to never activate nested quotes. I hate them.
I have visited forums with nested quotes where the quote sometimes ran 20 levels deep and the largest answer was about 4 words long. Nuts, plain nuts.
I don't think people really care, as long as they aren't "shell-shocked' by a change, silly as that sounds. In other words, if stripping nested quotes was the default, and you suddenly turned it off after the members were used to it, they'd probably be just as pissed off about it.
"WTF! Why are we now seeing all this nested mess when we click the quote button!" :wow:
If you aren't careful, as I've found, the initial settings of your forum are going to be what people get accustomed to, and any change will reap complaints. So - all you new Admins - please know what the Hell you are doing when you install and set up a new forum! :cool:
P.S. Unlike I did back in the day.
100
Archived fixes / Database Error while adding additional text to my Signature
« on May 22nd, 2013, 02:02 AM »
I was under the max allowed -
Max characters: 500; characters remaining: 287
But got this error. I tried twice and got it twice -
Database Error
Please try again. If you come back to this error screen, report the error to an administrator.
Max characters: 500; characters remaining: 287
But got this error. I tried twice and got it twice -
Database Error
Please try again. If you come back to this error screen, report the error to an administrator.
101
Off-topic / Re: Automagically De-Nesting Quotes
« on May 22nd, 2013, 01:44 AM »Perhaps if it were enabled by default on a fresh installation... hmm. Needs more thought.
"Do not quote more text than is needed to make your point. All the points everyone has made are in the thread. That's what the thread is there for - to hold all the points. A quote should be short and simply to jog the memory and help people reading to understand what you are addressing, blah, blah, blah ..."
Something like that. Mainly new members would not understand how the quote button should be handled correctly. They simply thought it was there to respond to any member in the thread. But as I would scold them - no, it's only to be used to attach a short amount of specific material that you want to rebut. You MUST edit out all unneeded material down before posting! Otherwise, simply do this -
Member xyz, I have this to say about your last point ...
102
Off-topic / Re: Automagically De-Nesting Quotes
« on May 22nd, 2013, 01:28 AM »Removing the other quotes is sort of the point. You really don't need all the extra quotes and as far as readability goes, it seems to me to promote wall-of-text syndrome by making wall-of-quotes. The head of the quote is still a link back to the previous post so it's not like you can't easily get the original context.
It was a disaster - not because it didn't work but because the members hated it. They loved their nested quotes and I gave up trying to convince them of the same logic you just outlined. After that I tried to police all the wall-quotes as lazy members would just quote away without thinking about it, repeating already-posted items completely with ridiculous amounts of text. I even used the warning system to try and stop it. It was to no avail. Fortunately my forum has better behaving members in that respect. :)
103
Off-topic / Re: Automagically De-Nesting Quotes
« on May 22nd, 2013, 01:15 AM »Well, there's already an option in SMF (and has been for some time) to strip nested quotes so you'd only have the outermost quote in the first place.
I see where you're going but I'm not entirely sure I like the look of it. Would be interested to see what other comments there are.
104
Off-topic / Automagically De-Nesting Quotes
« on May 22nd, 2013, 01:04 AM »
I searched but didn't find this discussed before. I sometimes de-nest quotes manually for what I feel like is easier reading. I wonder if anyone else has ever thought that this would be a useful forum feature? It places the person's membername closer to the start of their quote for easier association, especially when there is more text.
Instead of going from the inside out -Quote from xrunner on May 22nd, 2013, 12:48 AM You'd see this going from first to last in sequence -Quote from Arantor on May 8th, 2013, 05:07 PM Quote from Wanchope on May 8th, 2013, 05:56 PM Quote from xrunner on May 22nd, 2013, 12:48 AM
Instead of going from the inside out -
Test test test additional comment.Quote from Wanchope on May 8th, 2013, 05:56 PM You need to see the picture of Facebook back in 2004,...Quote from Arantor on May 8th, 2013, 05:07 PM Mostly because they set up their style in the old days, then got big in spite of ugly design, and had to keep it to avoid upsetting the existing fans.
Mostly because they set up their style in the old days, then got big in spite of ugly design, and had to keep it to avoid upsetting the existing fans.
You need to see the picture of Facebook back in 2004,...
Test test test additional comment.
105
Test board / Re: xrunner's testing thread (anyone is invited of course)
« on May 22nd, 2013, 12:48 AM »You need to see the picture of Facebook back in 2004,you will just lol.I don't think upgrading a user driven website outlook will upset them,granted,many will complain which is just normal,majority will be happy because humans like renovation. Many websites are known for their colours — Facebook is White and blue,Google White background...This is what I think should be maintained, improvement by adding smooth interactive function like ajax is a must. There is a need to move with web trends. Thanks.Quote from Arantor on May 8th, 2013, 05:07 PM Mostly because they set up their style in the old days, then got big in spite of ugly design, and had to keep it to avoid upsetting the existing fans.