Wedge

Public area => The Pub => Off-topic => Topic started by: Arantor on May 16th, 2013, 08:42 PM

Title: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Arantor on May 16th, 2013, 08:42 PM
You guys all know vBulletin 5 is a train wreck, right?

If you didn't, here's the proof: http://www.vbulletin.com/faq/

For those who aren't interested in clicking on links etc, I'll share the truly WTF ones. I swear I'm not making any of this up, and you can look at the FAQ yourself.
Quote
Q: I was in the AdminCp and received an error message.

A: A number of features in the Admin CP no longer work. These can return error messages. Open a Support Topic or Ticket for further assistance.
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Q: Where is the Member's List?

A: There is no member's list in vBulletin 5.
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Q: Where is the FAQ system?

A: The FAQ System is not supported in vBulletin 5.0. It will return in a future version.
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Q: Where is the infraction system?

A: The infraction system is not supported in vBulletin 5.0. It will return in a future version.
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Q: What happened to the CMS and all my articles?

A: The CMS/Article System is not supported in vBulletin 5.0. It will return in a future version. Your articles are being kept safe in a hidden channel and will return when the CMS is released.
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Q: There is no place for my users to purchase Paid Subscriptions

A: Paid Subscriptions are not supported in vBulletin 5. They will return in a future version.
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Q: I tried to import a custom language and received a database error.

A: We do not support localization at this time. This will be available in a future release.
And this is a supported product, or something.
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: spoogs on May 16th, 2013, 08:45 PM
Lmao

So essentially vB will return in  future version
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Arantor on May 16th, 2013, 08:50 PM
I wouldn't be on that either >_<
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: xrunner on May 16th, 2013, 09:09 PM
No members list? Huh? And you have to pay over $200 for it? :lol:
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Dragooon on May 16th, 2013, 09:24 PM
Surely there's more. This is just the stuff they're officially admitting. What happened to vbulletin?
Posted: May 16th, 2013, 09:21 PM

Holy crap, that FAQ is too good to be true...
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: icari on May 16th, 2013, 09:34 PM
i wonder why more people that use VB5 are not trying to convert to smf :P
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Wanchope on May 16th, 2013, 10:20 PM
Here comes the end of the most overrated forum script on earth :)
#burial
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Arantor on May 16th, 2013, 10:32 PM
I dunno, vB 3 justified its price tag to me. But vB 5... nah.
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Nao on May 16th, 2013, 10:40 PM
lol topic... :lol:

I think we should sell Wedge for $400. I'm sure a lot of vBulletin users will see it means it's twice better than vB5. And worst of all... They'll be right!! :^^;:

Ah ah, just saw that they're not supporting styles and plugins either... And they're selling the right to remove their copyright notice... At $169 per licence. In addition to the $249 of the software license in itself...

Yeah, they're definitely crazy.
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: live627 on May 16th, 2013, 11:19 PM
That... heh. Insanity.
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Wanchope on May 17th, 2013, 12:01 AM
Jive Forum script license price
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$14950 flat fee, $1950/1000 users, $4950/5000 users, or $9950/20000 users.
LOL! Forum Software at a price of JEEP?
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: godboko71 on May 17th, 2013, 06:41 AM
That FAQ should read like this "We are sorry but we have pulled vB5 Connect off the market please use our UPGRADE script to go back to vBulletin 4.2 Publishing Suite. Our programmers assure us someone in the bean counting room made a mistake by releasing Alpha software to the wild."
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: ziycon on May 17th, 2013, 10:45 AM
That's ridiculous, I've always be on the fence about using vb but glad I didn't know, wouldn't want to be stuff with that lump as it stands.
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Powerbob on May 17th, 2013, 04:25 PM
Just checked there site and found loads of complaining users, but they don't seem to give a shit!
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: xrunner on May 17th, 2013, 07:50 PM
OK, this has been bugging the hell out of me since yesterday. How can there not be a member's list? Isn't that like one of the most basic things a forum has to have - the list of members? Duh. How can it even operate without it?
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Arantor on May 17th, 2013, 08:16 PM
Quite easily. I don't remember the last time I looked at the member's list here...

(not defending vBulletin, just saying the member's list isn't necessarily a huge deal)
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: xrunner on May 17th, 2013, 08:30 PM
I'm still not understanding something. A forum has members. The list of members has to be in the database. So how can there not be a member's list - a table in the database? Isn't it by definition a requirement to have a list of members? How can you keep track of who's a member of the forum if you don't have that? What am I not understanding here? I know I must be sounding incredibly stupid but I really don't follow why a member's list would not/could not be provided extremely easily.
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: spoogs on May 17th, 2013, 08:36 PM
Ok so Arantor beat me to it. I dont think the member list is really important either. I've even wanted to remove it from the menu and maybe put it in or next to the who's online bit. I spent more than a year moderating a vB forum before even figuring where the members list was.

I'm sure the table.is there,just no means of displaying the list like with the members button here.
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Arantor on May 17th, 2013, 08:37 PM
Sure it does in the database.

There is no technical reason why one could not have been added easily. Just that they didn't.

I'd note that XenForo has altered how they present the memberlist, so that it can be disabled entirely, they discuss it in http://xenforo.com/community/threads/more-assorted-things.50098/
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: xrunner on May 17th, 2013, 08:42 PM
OK guys. :bah:

I always use the member list to look at things such as sorting it by registration date, number of replies, last logon time,last logon date,  position ... I look at those lists to learn what is going on with my members. Maybe I'm too anal retentive but I use it a lot.
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Arantor on May 17th, 2013, 08:44 PM
Oh, I'm not saying it doesn't have a use. Simply that we (spoogs and I, can't vouch for anyone else) don't have a lot of use for it.
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: xrunner on May 18th, 2013, 01:02 AM
Quote from Arantor on May 17th, 2013, 08:44 PM
Oh, I'm not saying it doesn't have a use. Simply that we (spoogs and I, can't vouch for anyone else) don't have a lot of use for it.
Acknowledged.

Follow-up question if I may. If the member list function/retrieval process worked in a previous version of this vBulletin, why might they have removed the "feature"? It seems like it is a rather benign sort of computing process - getting together a memberlist. Do you think they considered removing it an improvement, or do you think other "improvements" in other areas may have broken it and they didn't have time to fix it? In other words have you any insight into why something like a member list would be removed?

Thanks.
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Arantor on May 18th, 2013, 01:12 AM
Because, apparently, vB 5 is a 'built from scratch', meaning that instead of evolving vB 4, they trashed it and started over, like they did with vB 4 after vB 3.

There are some legitimate reasons you might do that, in terms of code cleanliness perhaps, but otherwise it's generally an admission that what you had before is so bad it can't be fixed.

In this case, they started from fresh, didn't have the memberlist code and decided they weren't going to write it. Notice the lack of 'it will be added in future versions', almost conspicuous in its absence, unlike the warnings system which is merely a 'shit, we ran out of time' moment because they rushed it in an attempt to get it out the door prior to the lawsuit wrapping up. Unfortunately it may have cost them more dearly than the meagre (by all accounts) sales they did manage to get out of that exercise.

Mind you, phpBB 4 is in a similar situation to that, they're not going to upgrade phpBB 3.x, but phpBB 4 is a 'from scratch', not that phpBB doesn't need a serious overhaul or anything ;) Though it's a bit different when you're talking about a group of volunteers making something vs a company pushing out a paid product.


:edit: vB 4 was not 'from scratch' entirely because vB 3 was a trainwreck that couldn't be fixed, it was that the code was perceived to be creaking from being too powerful and too tightly woven and they wanted to uncouple things somewhat. That, in itself, is fair enough reason to do so, only it needed to have been done properly, something which Internet Brands wasn't willing to pay for. XenForo, effectively, is what vB 4 would have been had Kier and Mike been allowed to build it their way rather than outsourcing coders and letting head office 'quality check' (which is what happened with vB 4 and that was a buggy POS when it landed, but nothing on the scale of vB 5)
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Anonchair on May 18th, 2013, 01:14 AM
vBulletin has my congratulations for being the first digital technology that smells.
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: kimikelku on May 18th, 2013, 03:11 PM
How can you sell a software that has an admincp with options that if you click do nothing?
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: YogiBear on May 18th, 2013, 03:54 PM
It reminds me of the craze during the 1980's for Nouvelle Cuisine : you pay high prices for almost nothing on your plate.  >:(

I did go onto a VB demo site to look around the admin section but to me it looked clumsier than phpBB.
Title: Re: Oh, I meant to share this a while ago
Post by: Maxx on May 19th, 2013, 02:19 AM
I never much ever cared for Vboard, I like SMF better in many ways, and hopefully Wedge will and SMF will get more attention now. Nut still the Wedge and the plug-in ideas, as they seem, will be bigger plus, in way the more usefulness of the system (not just a forum). Never had much trouble operation the older versions of Vb, but like I said did not care for it, and they all looked to the same, at lease most times!

Many times these things happen when they get too big, and gain too much confidence. ...same thing happens to Face B00k and others out there, so this the time for SMF to get moving, maybe?? or not. depends on ( who Knows ) now days but the door is opening! I know Wedge is ever moving so, that's cool!
 
regards,
Maxx