Wedge

Public area => Development blog => Topic started by: Nao on November 1st, 2012, 06:27 PM

Title: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Nao on November 1st, 2012, 06:27 PM
...And 2 months, and 2 days.
Okay, maybe not 2 days, more like 6, but apart from Pete and I, you weren't there to count in the beginning, were you? ;)

Just in case you aren't aware yet, I finally managed to put the finishing touches to a 'usable' version of Wedge, and released it early this morning to early beta testers.

In order to download it, you'll have to request access in the relevant topic, but since this is still a private alpha, we're going to be giving access mostly to those of you who've been following us for some time (and posting along), anyone who seems serious about Wedge and testing it.

Our plans are to release a public alpha before the end of the year (well, just in case the Incas were right). We're going to try and keep Wedge in frozen mode, so we won't be adding any new (major) features, although we do have a few outstanding features (or bug fixes) which we plan to ship before we go public. And who knows, maybe we'll have a good week at some point and will even be able to go gold before the end of the year...? Naah, can't be.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Dr. Deejay on November 1st, 2012, 06:35 PM
Congratulations with the alpha release. You have both done an outstanding job and I really like Wedge so far. :)
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: nolsilang on November 1st, 2012, 07:31 PM
Congratulations! :) Will patiently wait.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: MultiformeIngegno on November 1st, 2012, 08:43 PM
Yuppi!!!!! Yes!! I remember the first days! All the moves between domains :P
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Aaron Smith on November 2nd, 2012, 12:20 AM
Good job guys!

I can't wait to put all your hard work to use. Really excited for you guys and the rest of us.

Aaron
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: william777 on November 2nd, 2012, 02:18 AM
Congratulations Nao. I had been following the developments of Wedge and it is worth the wait. Two years is not a long time to produce an outstanding software considering only two of you were at it.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: b4pjoe on November 2nd, 2012, 02:24 AM
Very nice. I'm very impressed with it thus far in my testing. :cool:
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: billy2 on November 2nd, 2012, 09:25 AM
Belated YaaaaY !!

Well done you two
 :cool:
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Dismal Shadow on November 2nd, 2012, 09:49 AM
They forget their faith in 2 devs. Arantor and Nao took them with them because they were vain, because they wanted to be want to be better than SMF. Look at them. The Users Who Waited for Wedge. They not heroes. They really are just men in a box. And it’s time they saw each other as they really are. It’s time to stop waiting.

Ok that doesn't make any sense.. :p
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: agent47 on November 2nd, 2012, 09:52 AM
Props to the two of you for pulling off such a fine piece of software. I've always had respect for the two of you ever since I discovered Aeva Media and on behalf of the SMF community I just want to say how much we appreciate your work and what great human beings the two of you lads are! I take my hats off to the two of you. May god bless you both.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Norodo on November 2nd, 2012, 10:48 AM
Congrats!
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: billy2 on November 2nd, 2012, 02:17 PM
Quote from Nathan Sparrow on November 2nd, 2012, 09:49 AM
They forget their faith in 2 devs. Arantor and Nao took them with them because they were vain, because they wanted to be want to be better than SMF. Look at them. The Users Who Waited for Wedge. They not heroes. They really are just men in a box. And it’s time they saw each other as they really are. It’s time to stop waiting.

Ok that doesn't make any sense.. :p
:lol:
glad you realise that
 :yahoo:
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Arantor on November 2nd, 2012, 04:01 PM
You're trying to quote Doctor Who, but neither I or Nao are the Doctor. ;)
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: emanuele on November 2nd, 2012, 04:21 PM
Good news!
Congratulations!
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Zealotus on November 6th, 2012, 12:23 AM
Yay! Finally what I've been waiting for!
I know, I haven't posted here but I've been following the project for quite some time (Way before I created the account here).

I'll be looking forward to the public alpha! :D
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Auk on November 7th, 2012, 09:02 PM
Well done, congratulations with getting this far in software development.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: NonSecwitter on November 9th, 2012, 11:31 PM
Congrats! I wish I was one of those faithful followers! :lol: You are ninja's of the internet <_<  :thanks:
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Nao on November 10th, 2012, 06:43 PM
Quote from Arantor on November 2nd, 2012, 04:01 PM
You're trying to quote Doctor Who, but neither I or Nao are the Doctor. ;)
...Or at least until proven guilty!
(Silly humans!)

@JPAnderson> It's not too late ;)

Plus, as I said earlier, we'll end up releasing a Public Alpha at some point..!
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Nao on November 10th, 2012, 08:09 PM
Quote from emanuele on November 2nd, 2012, 04:21 PM
Good news!
Congratulations!
Wanna have a look at it? ;)
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Pentaxian on November 12th, 2012, 10:29 AM
Good news indeed.
Congratulations!
I'm looking forward to it.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: eolith on November 20th, 2012, 03:15 AM
Fantastic! I've been watching this for most of those two years, and I keep checking back to see just what the status is. I'm ready to move my forums to something more modern than SMF, as I'm getting tired of the lack of development with SMF. It seems even the mod packages aren't being developed any more.

I'm definitely hoping to be able to get Wedge soon!

While I know I haven't been posting much, I'd like to be able to set up a small installation on my server just to see what it takes and what kinds of features I'd be able to put to use in order to switch over my forums. Is that at all a possibility?
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: BellGab.com on November 25th, 2012, 10:55 PM
Would you guys say Wedge is more efficient than SMF when it comes to consumption of server resources?
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Nao on November 25th, 2012, 11:29 PM
I don't know, as I always say, it's going to save your server bandwidth, that I'm sure of.

Weird avatar.

eolith, yes it is, if you post more. But you didn't, even after that post. ;)
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: garidan on November 26th, 2012, 02:37 PM
Quote from Nao on November 25th, 2012, 11:29 PM
I don't know, as I always say, it's going to save your server bandwidth, that I'm sure of.

Weird avatar.

eolith, yes it is, if you post more. But you didn't, even after that post. ;)
Your avatar isn't such more beautiful :eheh:

I like the wedge progress so far, I found you at your beginning when selecting a forum and waving between SMF and MyBB.
Now I'm opting to migrate from Drupal Advanced Forum to SMF (they have a migration path), while waiting for your release: it seems to me it's the cleaner way to upgrade to wedge when it's ready for production.
The aim is to go for a SMF (wedge) + wordpress community site.
In the meantime I would like to see and try wedge: if you want me to post more a I can spam too ... Seriously, if you let me see wedge I think _I can post "clever" suggestions and look a little inside.
Good work
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: BellGab.com on November 27th, 2012, 06:56 PM
Quote from Nao on November 25th, 2012, 11:29 PM
I don't know, as I always say, it's going to save your server bandwidth, that I'm sure of.
it will be interesting to see how wedge affects server ram/cpu vs. SMF.  i get the impression SMF has a lot of loose ends in terms of efficiency.  i have no data with which to quantify this, but there are anecdotal reasons why i believe it to be the case.

i think you guys ought to open it up to testers regardless of how many posts they might have here.  the more people running the software and attempting to break it, the better.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Arantor on November 27th, 2012, 07:24 PM
Quote
but there are anecdotal reasons why i believe it to be the case.
Such as?
Quote
i think you guys ought to open it up to testers regardless of how many posts they might have here.  the more people running the software and attempting to break it, the better.
Except for the inevitable hurdles of 1) upgrading (there's no working upgrader), and 2) people who shouldn't be using alpha software will end up using it only to complain when something is broken or missing, and then complain about the way we do things.

There have been an awful lot of people who've put their name into the ring not because they want to test it but because they want the latest shiny shiny. We're pretty good at weeding that out. Right now, if I'm honest, your tone is distinctly in this latter category; you want Wedge but you don't seem to want to say *why* you want it, just that you know you want it.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: BellGab.com on November 28th, 2012, 04:46 AM
Quote
Except for the inevitable hurdles of 1) upgrading (there's no working upgrader), and 2) people who shouldn't be using alpha software will end up using it only to complain when something is broken or missing, and then complain about the way we do things.
i was unaware of the upgrader issue.  and yes, it probably would be a **** storm if inexperienced forum owners, or people who simply don't understand a thing about development, were to attempt to use it at this time.  i'm an experienced forum admin, but in terms of development... i'm useless.
Quote
There have been an awful lot of people who've put their name into the ring not because they want to test it but because they want the latest shiny shiny. We're pretty good at weeding that out. Right now, if I'm honest, your tone is distinctly in this latter category; you want Wedge but you don't seem to want to say *why* you want it, just that you know you want it.
and right now, if i'm honest, i have to say you couldn't be more wrong in interpreting my tone.  i wouldn't put this software anywhere near my forum at this time.  it's not that i don't want to use wedge.  of course i do.  of course, everyone does.  i think it's brilliant what you guys have done here, and as soon as it's gold, i'll definitely upgrade... but i've spent years growing my forum and i've worked very hard to maintain it... so i'm not interested in endangering it with what's classified by the developers as pre alpha.  so... latter category?  me thinks not.  i'm happy to wait until i can upgrade with confidence. 

all of that aside, i haven't asked to install wedge.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Arantor on November 28th, 2012, 04:57 AM
Quote
i was unaware of the upgrader issue.  and yes, it probably would be a **** storm if inexperienced forum owners, or people who simply don't understand a thing about development, were to attempt to use it at this time.  i'm an experienced forum admin, but in terms of development... i'm useless.
Which is why we're not giving it out to anyone except people we know that can deal with this stuff.
Quote
all of that aside, i haven't asked to install wedge.
No, but you *did* suggest it should be opened up to more people. There's a whole range of interpretations of that statement. It ranges everywhere from 'more people should try it, it might get more bugs found and squished' (unlikely) through 'more people should try it, because it's worth trying' and on to 'more people, including me, should have the option to try it' and all the way to 'if I suggest more people should try it, maybe I'll get to play with it in the name of testing'. Text is a wonderfully compact format, it cuts out so much of the non-verbal context that could easily change how your statement is interpreted.

But understand it from my point of view: I've seen many, many people make variations on the same statement, and the vast majority of them don't want it for testing, they just want it because they want it - they don't really want to help with the development or testing, they just want the software. I experienced this most vividly with SimpleDesk; 90% of the beta testers never submitted a bug report, or a suggestion or indeed ANYTHING. Why should this be any different? Yet virtually every one of the beta testers put in some variation about how it should be opened up for testing so that more people would find bugs.

Already the majority of people with beta tester badges haven't said *that* much, though what they have said has been pretty positive - and yet, I know full well that some of them have barely touched it for anything.

I make no apologies for my cynicism. I've been burned way too many times by people making requests 'in the name of the greater good' such as you might call it and almost every single time it's about justifying giving them personally a benefit rather than actually benefiting the greater good.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: BellGab.com on November 28th, 2012, 05:33 AM
Quote from Arantor on November 28th, 2012, 04:57 AM
I experienced this most vividly with SimpleDesk; 90% of the beta testers never submitted a bug report, or a suggestion or indeed ANYTHING.
i don't find that surprising.  laziness and a tendency toward consumption are what i expect from human beings in pretty much any life situation.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Arantor on November 28th, 2012, 05:37 AM
And that's why we don't want to give it out to more people - we'd rather limit the exposure to people who are likely to actually do something with it.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Dismal Shadow on November 28th, 2012, 10:13 PM
Yeah, I do this because I love to test things and because it's fun. I test things and make it into a quality software. I don't have a domain and put it live because I want shiny and latest software om my website. I just love bugs. ;)
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Oracle on November 28th, 2012, 11:26 PM
Ha Ha. > Sounds like your in the wrong business - Should be in pest extermination of some sort...real job real doe - "Only kidding Nate"
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: sascape on November 29th, 2012, 01:35 PM
I'm in the shiny-shiny category. That's why I'm waiting so patiently. I have basic knowledge about maintaining a forum but that's it. With the next upgrade I would probably make my forum explode ;)
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Powerbob on November 30th, 2012, 01:26 PM
We are on Alpha 2 and I have to say it's very stable all things considered :cool:
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Sea Mac on December 1st, 2012, 04:21 AM
I eagerly await the Public Alpha.

I'd apply for the private Alpha but I don't have the time right now to do a good test justice.

I've been a forum member a long time but computer issues have kept me from being underfoot.

Congratulations on reaching this Milestone!!!
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: wluckie on December 11th, 2012, 10:51 PM
Congrats on your hatching a new product. Look forward to the release or public beta.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Nao on December 12th, 2012, 12:10 PM
Oh, maybe we should release Alpha 3 at some point... It's been at least a month since Alpha 2 ;)
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Arantor on December 12th, 2012, 01:40 PM
Yeah, I was thinking about that given the additions I made to moderation filters. Now all I need to do is finish the overhauled ban and warning system.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Nao on December 12th, 2012, 06:41 PM
I'm sure it can wait for alpha 4 though ;)
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Arantor on December 12th, 2012, 06:48 PM
Sure it can ;)

To be honest I'd prefer to get everything we have out in A3, and then have A4 predominantly about the ban and warning stuff where it can be examined mostly in isolation, and once that's the case, we can look at tidying up and thinking about beta since that's the last 'big' thing that's missing at this stage.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Powerbob on December 13th, 2012, 06:21 AM
That's good news guys :cool:
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Farjo on January 23rd, 2013, 03:47 PM
Quote from Nao on December 12th, 2012, 12:10 PM
Oh, maybe we should release Alpha 3 at some point... It's been at least a month since Alpha 2 ;)
Sorry to be cheeky, but can I request this? I've got to the stage where if I test something I'm unsure if a bug has been reported or fixed already. I've got time off the beginning of next week and am thinking ahead to then.

Of course I don't know how much time it takes to push out a new version so if it's tricky feel free to swear at me ;) And yes I know I could be spending Wedge-time on documentation :whistle:
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Nao on January 23rd, 2013, 04:10 PM
Actually, most of my commits of the last few days were done with a future alpha in mind... ;)
I'm not sure about Pete but I think we can release one with the caveat that "banning and plugins may or may not be severely broken", and NOT to report any bugs about them.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Arantor on January 23rd, 2013, 04:57 PM
Banning mostly is missing UI, and plugins are mostly done again except missing the last of the UI processing.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: garidan on January 24th, 2013, 05:31 AM
I have to write code to export our forum from Drupal Advanced Forum to SMF or Wedge.
I aim to go online with the new forum within 2 months, but there's no hurry.
Do you think I could go directly to Wedge and test it or I would better go to SMF and when Wedge is ready migrate ?
I would like not to do 2 migrations, and would better wait a little more for wedge.
What do you think ?
Are wedge tables a lot different, or completely equal to SMF ones :whistle: ?
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Arantor on January 24th, 2013, 05:36 AM
There's a lot of change, and there's a lot of similarity too. Hard to say without knowing exactly what joins you're trying to make.

I can guarantee you you're not going to get something in the next two months that would be called stable. It's *possible* you might see a public release of some kind, but it won't be stable if it is. I don't know, really depends on how the next couple of months shapes up as to whether we do any kind of public release in that time, but no chance of being a stable one.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Nao on January 27th, 2013, 06:34 PM
Quote from garidan on January 24th, 2013, 05:31 AM
I have to write code to export our forum from Drupal Advanced Forum to SMF or Wedge.
Any reason for that, BTW?
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: garidan on February 5th, 2013, 02:54 AM
Quote from Nao on January 27th, 2013, 06:34 PM
Quote from garidan on January 24th, 2013, 05:31 AM
I have to write code to export our forum from Drupal Advanced Forum to SMF or Wedge.
Any reason for that, BTW?
I may not understand what you mean, but the reason is I have a forum built in drupal and it has grown too big for it to manage.
We are aiming toward a SMF/wedge + wordpress platform, a forum + CMS solution: drupal is good, but in a shared hosting it gets too slow and it's not easy too use.

There are no migration paths from Drupal Advanced Forum to anyother forum software, so it would have value for wedge to be that one.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Arantor on February 5th, 2013, 02:58 AM
I would strongly suggest not using WP with Wedge. The two will not play nicely and in all honesty there will end up being little reason to have WP when Wedge will be able to cover the bases (and do it *much* more efficiently)
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: WasdMan on March 21st, 2013, 05:02 PM
Hi guys. Sorry if my English is weak. And I'm sorry if I write the wrong place.

My question is that in Hungary on the SMF support system. I really like the Wedge. I wonder how I could use it on aa my own page?
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Arantor on March 21st, 2013, 05:12 PM
Wedge is not publicly available at this time. Only selected alpha testers have access to it.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: WasdMan on March 22nd, 2013, 05:31 PM
Testing can be made? Translated into Hungarian ...

And another question ...

When can we expect public release?
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Arantor on March 22nd, 2013, 05:36 PM
Quote
When can we expect public release?
When you read the topics around on that very subject, like the one telling you it'll be done when it's done. Still so much to do.
Quote
Testing can be made?
You can request access in the proper thread like everyone else.
Quote
Translated into Hungarian ...
I would not recommend translation at this time. Given how much change is shortly to be introduced, it would be a bad move.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: WasdMan on March 22nd, 2013, 05:39 PM
Quote
You can request access in the proper thread like everyone else.
This is where you need to ask? Topic or privately?
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Arantor on March 22nd, 2013, 05:41 PM
If you can't find it - it's a public topic - then you have absolutely no business doing testing. We do expect users to show a certain amount of initiative, experience and energy, and I'm just not seeing that so far.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Nao on March 22nd, 2013, 06:08 PM
+1...
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: TomW on June 28th, 2013, 03:29 AM
You two are really showing some true dedication.  I am looking forward to the first public release.  Congratulations !
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: wluckie on September 16th, 2013, 09:47 PM
Why no updates to this blog in a year? I thought it was to track development of Wedge.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Pandos on September 16th, 2013, 11:14 PM
If you want to keep track of developement this is the wrong place.
http://wedge.org/pub/feats/6108/new-revs/
This is the place to go.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Nao on September 16th, 2013, 11:19 PM
Technically, he's not wrong... It's just that I'm not much into developing a thesis around development, if you will. I'm more of an action guy (well, a bit less these days...), and I'll centralize all of my development history into one place -- the changelog, i.e. also the New Revs topic, where I post all of my new commits.

I'm planning to write a blog entry on Pete's departure, and possibly a tentative roadmap (which I believe John just requested of me ;)), and also post something on our (well, my..?) Facebook page, but... Really, I'm a bit overwhelmed. Even when I don't seem to be doing a lot on Wedge, I'm still doing stuff, trying to figure out what I need to do, and also killing real-life bugs. (Sometimes, even literally :P)
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: live627 on September 17th, 2013, 02:14 AM
Quote
and possibly a tentative roadmap (which I believe John just requested of me ;)),
I also expected at least one reply from both you and Dragooon...
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Nao on September 17th, 2013, 06:40 AM
As far as long posts go, I had an email convo with Pete yesterday (cla stuff), so my Hans were full. ^^

Hands. Silly s3.
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: live627 on September 17th, 2013, 09:24 AM
Probably a cover-up for "I'll do it later"please prove me wrong.

Ten lines isn't long.
Posted: September 17th, 2013, 09:20 AM

(almost thought that looked like cia with the letter I, but it's a L)
Title: Re: It only took two guys two years...
Post by: Nao on September 17th, 2013, 11:48 AM
Proved you wrong!
And you KNOW I couldn't do a proper roadmap... You're just teasing me :P

Sorry about the spelling this morning... I'd just gotten out of bed, and couldn't be arsed to go to my PC to reply, eh.